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Discovering Work You Love - Nick Williams on the BBC Asian Network

INTERVIEWER: So, you've been doing your job for the last few years - or maybe for most of your life - and it's no longer a challenge. Also something’s niggling in the back of your mind - is it really what you want to be doing? Maybe you want to do something different, something more worthwhile, like help people through your work or running your own business? But what if you haven't got the guts to take that first step - or maybe you have no idea about how you’d go about taking that first step. Well, if this is you, I want you to get in touch with the program right now because my next guest could put you on the path to success. Nick Williams has inspired thousands of people to do the work they were born to do. 08459 440 445, if you hate your job - and want to escape - I think it's worth picking up the phone and giving me a call. Nick, it's nice to have you here.

NICK WILLIAMS: Good morning, thank you for inviting me in.

INTERVIEWER: Do you enjoy what you do?

NICK WILLIAMS: Of course. I’d be a bit of a hypocrite if I didn't!

INTERVIEWER: So are you a life coach?

NICK WILLIAMS: That's one of the things I do. Increasingly I describe myself as a practical ‘work philosopher’ - and my philosophy is quite simple. I think that work is too important a part of human life for us not to enjoy it. I think it’s such a shame when people don't enjoy what they do because it's such a big part of people's lives. That was my story too: in my late 20s I was dissatisfied with what I was doing and I plucked up the courage to change, and follow my heart, and here I am many years later having written five books and traveled around the world. My life is very meaningful because I know I’ve helped thousands of people to find their way in life. I wake up in the morning and feel blessed for what I get to do!

INTERVIEWER: So, you've obviously tapped into something.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes.

INTERVIEWER: Lot's of people are dissatisfied with their jobs?

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. I think that’s the biggest shame… and I'm not knocking career advisers - but my experience of careers advice is that it’s fairly limiting. My career’s advisor at school was a physics teacher. He was newly married, needed a bit of extra money, so he did careers advice a couple of times a week to earn a bit of extra cash. But I found out afterwards that he’d gone straight from school into college - and back into school to teach – so what experience of the ‘world of work’ did he really have? So, I think it’s fairly common that most of us don't get a lot of great advice about how we can discover work that we would really love to do. The heart of it for me is that work should be something that we love doing not that we resent or moan about. And I think many of us don't get good advice... We get advice from our parents, and we get influenced by the expectations of the people around us when we’re growing up. So often we acquiesce to them, and do what we think people want us to do for approval - and often in our mid-to-late 20’s some of us start questioning what we are doing and asking ‘is this really me?’ So that's often where I intervene and help people start thinking differently.

INTERVIEWER: Why is that? Is it possibly because people don't think of work as being something that they should enjoy, or something they’d really want to do. Or is it ‘just a job’ and ‘just about earning’ --

NICK WILLIAMS: Certainly in the British culture! But also I see this played out as I travel around the world in America and Europe, in Ireland and even Africa. This is what I call the ‘protestant work ethic’ that says; actually you shouldn’t expect to enjoy work. It’s almost like work is a curse, ‘just get used to it - it’s something you have to do to earn money so you can enjoy the rest of your life’. I've got wide interests - and I've read a number of different spiritual traditions - and most traditions talk about the potential blessing of work. That work can even be a way of expressing your spirituality – but if not – then at least your gifts and your talents and everything that was given to you in your creation. So, here’s a more empowering idea: work can actually be the expression of the best of us; it can be something that we can love AND that we can get paid generously for.

INTERVIEWER: But that can't always be practical, right? I mean, what do you do if somebody comes to you and says, well, I'm working in a factory, but what I actually want to do is to be an astronaut?

NICK WILLIAMS: Yeah… That's probably a little unrealistic because probably only about 20 people get to be astronauts - and is that person going to be one of them - unlikely. So yes, you are right; there is a difference between fantasies and dreams. A lot of people have fantasies, but I think a lot of people also have dreams - and for me a dream is something that's inside us, that we imagine, and we invest a lot of time thinking about. But often you don’t have anyone encouraging you to take action. So, one of the things I do as a coach, and through my workshops, is help people to honor their dreams and see what they could do to make them a reality. I had a dream 20 years ago of how my life could be - traveling around the globe and talking on the radio, books, events and the rest of it… I didn't know back then if it was a dream or a fantasy, but today, it's my reality... And I think many of us don't realize how powerful dreams are – we’re not encouraged to talk about our dreams. When we are growing up our parents and teachers will tell us ‘you have to grow up’, ‘stop day-dreaming’. All kids daydream but most of us ‘grown-ups’ are taught to stop daydreaming and ‘be realistic’. But, consider that every product that exists in the world right now was once just an idea in somebody's imagination. So, what’s in our imagination, and in our dreams, can often be the forthcoming attractions of what our life can be like - if we learn how to honor and nurture our dreams and bring them to fruition.

INTERVIEWER: 08459 440 445 - if you’re doing a job that you don't particularly enjoy. Have you found that you've been put into a situation where you’re having to do what you're doing for a living because you didn’t even consider the alternatives?. It's the cliché of becoming a doctor or a lawyer, or an accountant - all of these are fabulous and highly paid professions – and highly respected professions that Asians so favor. But is it actually what you wanted to do? Are you a doctor because you love being a doctor and have always wanted to be a doctor? Or are you a doctor because your mom and dad told you that you should be one? Pick up the phone; give me a call because Nick is here to give you advice. Let's speak to Jazz in Upton Park. Good morning Jazz!

JAZZ: Hi.

INTERVIEWER: How are you?

JAZZ: Very well, thank you. How are you?

INTERVIEWER: Very well, thanks. Speak to Nick, go on. You can chat - it's going to be Nick that is going to be giving advice. So, what's the problem? What's going on with you?

JAZZ: Well, hi Nick.

NICK WILLIAMS: Hi.

JAZZ: I'm 30 and I have a relatively good career. I kind of fell into it - and I think basically I just need to make a decision if this is what I want to pursue, or do I go off and do the whole ‘travel the world’ thing, because that's a passion of mine. And I suppose what I really need is somebody to give me the skills to take that decision.

NICK WILLIAMS: The skills AND the courage maybe….

JAZZ: Yes.

INTERVIEWER: I think Jazz probably isn't alone… I think there are probably loads of people in a similar situation.

NICK WILLIAMS: To be honest, I did the same thing in my late 20s - I had worked for a number of years in the ‘corporate world’ selling IT systems to big Japanese banks - and I was doing okay. I took a year out and traveled - and I loved it - and I wish I had done it sooner. Perhaps you want to take some time out - go traveling - and reassess when you come back and perhaps commit or recommit to some kind of career. Would you mind telling me what you do at the moment?

JAZZ: Well, I work within ‘digital marketing’ for a global corporate. And I suppose the challenging thing for me is that I have actually done what you say - I took six months out (a year or so ago) and I did the whole ‘traveling around the world’ thing… and then I came back. I think it was something I needed to get out of my system. I guess we all have this wish to see the world.

NICK WILLIAMS: Sure…

JAZZ: Yes. And I think for some people that’s enough. You do the six months traveling - or whatever - and you come back and say ‘great, that's done’. But I've come back, and now I really don't know what to do next! Do I carry on traveling, and maybe turn into one of those ‘career gapers’, if you will, or do I settle down in a stable career?

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. So, a couple of ideas. Number one: is it possible to create a career – doing your current profession – that will allow you to travel as well?

JAZZ: Potentially!

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. So, one option is to do similar things but to do them in a new way that serves you more... So, could you get creative and think of ways that you could be paid to travel and create skills that would get you working all around the world? Another question, do you have an unfulfilled dream - is there something else that you long to be doing?

JAZZ: Well, I think the unfulfilled dream is actually just to see the world. I mean, it might sound a bit ‘out there’ and a bit - all encompassing - but I’ve had a passion for this since I was very young – I’ve always wanted to travel the world - see new sights - and now I've started doing it.

NICK WILLIAMS: Great. So, I'll suggest a project called – ‘how can Jazz get paid to travel and see the world?’…

JAZZ: Yes.

INTERVIEWER: Yes, great. Hang on! I think that most people on the planet probably want the same thing!

NICK WILLIAMS: Yeah and that's where you can get creative. Again, it's starting to think creatively. Who else gets paid to do this? How did they manage it?

INTERVIEWER: Ha! Michael Palin!

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes! But I find it’s useful to have a ‘niche of expertise’ - something you're known for. Now, if you’ve a number of years experience in an area... That’s great… now what you may want to do is to start being perceived as an expert in that area. So you’ll then start getting invited to work with different people and different organizations – all over the world – who’ll pay you to travel out and work with them.

INTERVIEWER: But Jazz do you actually enjoy the job you're doing?

JAZZ: I think that’s the problem! I do. I like what I do.

NICK WILLIAMS: Why is that a problem?

JAZZ: I think it makes the decision even harder because it's a great job - I enjoy what I do - and I make good money out of it… but I suppose I don't know whether it would be feasible for me to fulfill my dream of traveling and still earn decent money – I guess.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. But you're doing what's fairly common in this situation… Because you don't know how this might happen, you immediately begin to close your thinking down… The question is how could you do it? Who does something similar? Who do you know that might need your skills? Do some research... Find out who else might need your particular experience around the world - start making contact with them - start offering yourself as a project manager. It's about thinking differently - because the way you’ve been thinking so far probably won’t help you to take that next step. You need to start thinking differently in order to take it to the next level.

INTERVIEWER: Does that make sense Jazz - does that sound possible?

JAZZ: It does, yes!

NICK WILLIAMS: Start thinking about what's possible and how you might do it. You might need to crank up your self-esteem and self-belief and start thinking more highly of yourself - before you’ll be ready to believe that there are people – around the world – who’d want to hire you in this way, instead of just as an employee.

INTERVIEWER: Self belief!

NICK WILLIAMS: Does that figure?

JAZZ: It does - yes.

NICK WILLIAMS: And in my experience that's at the heart of where many of us trip ourselves up – often we just don't think highly enough of ourselves. Could you start finding reasons to begin thinking a bit more highly of yourself – starting today?

JAZZ: I think I have quite a bit of self-confidence, but you always need more, don't you?

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes, maybe it's time to take it to the next level. It’s a whole new step to think that there may be people around the world that would love to hire you. I can see the seed of a new thought opening up in your mind!

JAZZ: Yes, this is interesting I never thought about it that way. I suppose that’s what's been holding me back. When I discussed my aspirations and my hopes - and I told people that I wanted to travel the world - I've had people saying to me ‘what does this mean for your career?’, ‘that means you're going to go back a couple of steps!’, and ‘how are you going to have a life if you're always off gallivanting?’.

NICK WILLIAMS: So, what you've got in your life - and what many of us have in our lives – are people that I call ‘Dreambashers’!

INTERVIEWER: Yes. I hate Dreambashers!

NICK WILLIAMS: As soon as we throw a good idea ‘out there’ they’re suddenly telling us the reasons why it wouldn’t work. Basically, they put their fear into us - and then we get afraid too. So what you need in your life are more people that I like to call ‘Dreambuilders’. These people like to explore how ideas could be possible, and help you open up possibilities rather than close them down. So you need more Dreambuilders in your life... Most of us have lots of Dreambashers and hardly any Dreambuilders. And for most of us, the worst Dreambashers are in our own heads, and that’s discounting friends and family!

INTERVIEWER: Yeah! Just because they couldn’t imagine doing it for themselves – they’re afraid of the idea that anybody else could even try.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. It brings up their insecurities.

INTERVIEWER: All right. Jazz, do you think Nick’s given you some ideas?

JAZZ: I definitely have a lot of food-for-thought now - thank you so much.

INTERVIEWER: Go for it! Don’t you not do it! I think the worst thing is having a dream ‘niggling’ in the back of your head - and never actually acting on it.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yeah. That’s often what we need to motivate ourselves to make a change. Project ahead to when your 50, 60, 70, or 80 - I think you’ll be grateful for the courage you're about to show.

JAZZ: Yes. I think that’s my greatest fear….

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. Most of us have adventurous souls - and we want to explore - so maybe it is time for a bit more of an adventure!

INTERVIEWER: Go for it, Jazz, and best of luck to you! Thank you very much for your call. If you’ve got any questions for Nick… if you are in a similar situation where you don’t feel that what you are doing is quite right for you, or you’ve always had an urge to go and do something else, but never managed to make the change - whatever your questions 08459 440 445 is the number to dial. You can also text 81869 and of course e-mail me. It would be funny if you’re e-mailing from the job that you hate! That would make you feel better!

INTERVIEWER: We’ve had an email from Kieran - he says “Hi Anita - I totally agree with your guest about careers advisers - in the sense that they usually don’t have the experience to encourage you to decide for yourself what you want to do. When I was deciding on my direction I took the typical IT route - which is not really what I enjoy. Luckily I had a placement year which helped me to realize I would be bored in this type of job - so after graduating - I took a conversion course to help me change my career path. Now I enjoy the work that I am doing and the direction I’m going in. But not everyone is so lucky. I think it’s easier to change direction in life when you are younger, and you can take more risks.” But Nick - what about if you’re older - say in your 40s or 50s - you’ve got children - you’ve got a mortgage. Maybe you've been in the same job for the last 20 or 30 years. What do you do then?

NICK WILLIAMS: A couple of things.... Just a general thing to start with... I think many of us have the belief that either you can do something you love and you’re NOT going to earn much money out of it. Or you can sell your soul for a paycheck. So, I think many of us only see a choice between one or the other. We don't consider the third possibility which is - when you do what you love - you're passion shines through, you're inspired, you get really competent – and ultimately - you're much more likely to be successful. So, I think there’s a faulty belief system that many people have; which says you can't earn money doing what you love. I totally disagree with this idea. I can point to hundreds of people who make a fantastic living doing work they love. Next point… I'm not about being irresponsible and saying ‘right – you’ve reached 50 - you're bored - just chuck it in!’ - with no idea what you're going to do next. I'm not about that... What I do is to help people make planned career transitions. To give you one example: there was someone who came to one of my workshops a few years ago... She was newly divorced, had a huge mortgage, a young son, and she was a nurse. But she knew that she’d outgrown her job in nursing…. Little by little, she realized what she wanted to do... She was passionate about communicating – and helping other nurses to communicate effectively - and she realized that what she really loved doing, more than anything else, was helping people to give up smoking. So she created a niche for herself in the NHS. And then she moved out - in the last few years - and started running her own business as an independent consultant. Just last week she had her second book published by Virgin Publishing – fully endorsed by the NHS - about giving up smoking. Now, she’s even more successful than she was when she was in the NHS. So, what I'm saying is that this was probably a five or six year career transition for her - which she did very consciously. She said, “This is where I am. This is where I want to be. And this is the route that I’m going to use to get there…” So I'm all for planning career transitions and knowing how you're going to achieve your dream – and sewing the seeds that will ultimately create your new life. A lot of people are very frustrated (or bored) with their jobs but they lack a long-term vision of where they want to be. So, they just end up procrastinating. What they rarely do is to create a strategic plan for moving forward. On of my roles it to help people to make achievable career transition plans.

INTERVIEWER: 08459 440 445, if you’ve got any questions for Nick, pick up the phone, and give him a call. Let's speak to Suki in Leicester. Good Morning Suki!

SUKI: Hi! Good morning.

INTERVIEWER: Hi! Suki, what would you like to say to Nick? What's going on with you?

SUKI: Well, I have passion for the job that I do part-time – but I’d like to do it more full-time. I also do another job part time - but I struggle financially.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. What's the job that you love that you're doing part-time?

SUKI: Beauty.

NICK WILLIAMS: Great...

SUKI: Yes. I absolutely – passionately – love it.

NICK WILLIAMS: Great. So you work for somebody else, or would you be self-employed?

SUKI: Self-employed. But the only problem is – there’s no funding when you get to a certain age bracket There is no help from anywhere for you to make that step.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. What you’ve describe to me is a fairly common thing… When there’s something we love doing what we need to recognize is that - just because we love doing something - and we may even be good at it – it doesn't guarantee that we can make our living out of it. So, it sounds to me like the next thing for you is to look at how you can attract more clients for your beauty business. So it's about marketing and client attraction.

SUKI: It's also having the time to do it… Because if you're working part-time – and you’ve got a family – and a beauty business. You haven't got the physical hours to do it....

NICK WILLIAMS: Great. Do you want a very quick practical tip?

SUKI: Yeah!

NICK WILLIAMS: Great. If you already have a bunch of happy clients – which presumably you have? Have you got their contact details or e-mail addresses or anything like that?

SUKI: Yes. I have.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. If you just contact them and say ‘I'm looking to give up my part-time job to focus on my beauty business full-time - do you know of other people who might be interested in using my services?’ I bet you, if you did this, you’d instantly get more business. If people like you – they’ll usually be happy to help you. And presumably your business is all about personal connection - and people like you - and you like them. Tell them what you want to do... Tell them you want to give up your other job and that you're looking for more business. Can they make some recommendations of friends who might like to hire you? So, this is what I was talking about - the ‘planned transition’. It probably won't just happen by itself. You’ll have to make a conscious choice and say “over the next 6 or 12 months - I want to give up my part-time job. I want to do my beauty work full-time.” Ask yourself – how are you going to do this from a practical point of view? Whose help can you enlist or enroll? How are you going to make it happen?

SUKI: Okay.

INTERVIEWER: Do you think that sounds doable?

SUKI: Yes. That sounds good!

INTERVIEWER: Has that made you feel more positive already?

SUKI: Yes. It has… It’s just taking that step!

NICK WILLIAMS: Yeah – and believing in yourself enough to take it!

INTERVIEWER: Have you got support at home Suki?

SUKI: Yes. I’ve got fantastic support. My kids and my husband are all great support. They do help me a lot - but it's now just about building it upto the next step – because other people are saying to me “How can you do it? Isn’t it tiring?” But - you know - I could work 22 hours a day in my beauty business and not feel tired!

NICK WILLIAMS: Sure - because you love it! That's the thing when you're doing what you love. It doesn't drain you. It energizes you!

INTERVIEWER: Wow – so you're saying that you could run your business 22 hours a day. I guess you're more productive - and you're better at it - because you love what you’re doing.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes – and you’re always curious – and you’re always learning. You’ll forever be improving and finding better ways of doing what you do. It sounds to me like you’re a natural networker!

SUKI: Yes.

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. That's what's going to help you grow your business. It's just networking. Talking to people... Maybe it's almost too obvious and too simple. I think that’s how most people that provide a personal service grow their business - through that personal contact and recommendation. The key is just to do it a little more consciously.

SUKI: Okay.

INTERVIEWER: All right. Best of luck to you! I'm quite excited – I’ll come and get my eyebrows sorted!

SUKI: No problem!

INTERVIEWER: All right. Thank you. 08459 440 445 is the number to dial. Let’s speak to Tasmin in Peterborough - good morning Tasmin.

TASMIN: Good morning.

INTERVIEWER: How are you?

TASMIN: I'm good. How are you?

INTERVIEWER: I'm very well. Thank you. What would you like to ask Nick? What's going on with you?

TASMIN: Up to about two years ago, I was doing IT programming… it’s not that I hated my job and it wasn't that I wasn't good at it. But, I wasn't as good as I wanted to be, and that drive – that motivation – to get better just wasn’t there. But I’ve always loved cooking! I love teaching - I wanted to give cooking classes.

NICK WILLIAMS: Wow!

TASMIN: My husband and I decided that one of us would leave work - because the children were getting older - they needed to be taxied around a bit more. There was no one to do it for us… So we planned for it. We blitzed our mortgage for about a year and a half. We didn't spend anything unnecessary…

INTERVIEWER: So, you paid it all off?

TASMIN: Almost. At least to the point where it was easily doable by one person... And then I gave up my job last September. Then I had nothing to lose. I had no income to lose. So, I thought - let's just give this a go!

NICK WILLIAMS: All right. How is it going?

TASMIN: It slow. It's great - but it is slow! Our first cooking class was in March - and it's gone from one class every two months to two classes a month.

NICK WILLIAMS: That's pretty good!

TASMIN: I'm optimistic that it will get better. And the more I do, the more I think “Why don't I try this? Why don't I try that?”... And so – in doing that – I’ve also got an opportunity to teach cooking in the local education college for adults.

INTERVIEWER: Wow. Fantastic!

TASMIN: So that will start in a few weeks time... Also, I’ve been experimenting with a range of easy to prepare food. They start out in powder form and you mix in the ingredients from scratch.

INTERVIEWER: Ha! Like trifle!

TASMIN: No! For example we have two types of bread, including fennel and coconut bread. You get the ingredients dry and then you add some melted butter - and put some milk in it – stick it in the oven for twenty minutes and you’ve got a loaf...

NICK WILLIAMS: You do this naturally! Here you are on national radio giving an impromptu cookery class!

TASMIN: I just get upset and frustrated when people think cooking is a chore - or cooking is boring – or cooking is hard and expensive. One of the courses that we’re hoping to hold at the college is teaching young moms how to cook healthily on a low budget - because that's what I had to do 15 years ago…

NICK WILLIAMS: Do you want an idea that's coming to me?

TASMIN: Yes.

NICK WILLIAMS: I think that one of the ways you’ll grow your business is by going out and giving talks.

TASMIN: Really?

NICK WILLIAMS: Because the way you're talking now - we could let you chat for the next 15 minutes – and we’d enjoy listening to you! So, I think you need to go out there and give more talks, and that would draw more people into your business because your passion shines through. One of your jobs will be to go out and inspire other people to be as passionate about cookery as you are.

TASMIN: But how would I do it?

NICK WILLIAMS: Try the local media or the local newspaper - and talk about the kinds of things that you’ve been talking to us about; that cooking doesn’t need to be drudgery, it can be fun and it can also be really enjoyable. That's your little niche if you like.

TASMIN: I do want to do that. One of the other things I want to do is try to introduce children to cookery early in their lives - maybe at the age of 11 or 12.

NICK WILLIAMS: Great, so you could go into schools.

TASMIN: Yes. That's a good idea.

NICK WILLIAMS: Again - like I was saying earlier - it's about networking… I think there are three ways we can get visibility for our business; we can network, we can give talks, and we can write. And I think you could do all three. You could write about it, talk about it, and network about it!

TASMIN: And eat it!

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. Wouldn't that be great! Now, you’ll have people queuing up because they want to taste it!

INTERVIEWER: Hey - maybe we could get you on our show? You should teach me how to cook.

TASMIN: That would be great! Maybe we could see how Anita progresses week-by-week...

INTERVIEWER: Yeah. Live cookery! Brilliant! We will sort that out. Tasmin, thank you very much and best of luck... Now, from what you've been saying, Nick - and from what you’ve been saying to the callers – is a lot of this to do with self-belief? Does is have a great deal to do with your own self-esteem and how positively you feel about yourself?

NICK WILLIAMS: Absolutly.I think firstly – you need to get inspired about something – and light that fire within you. That's probably the first thing – and all of our callers so far have had a sense of what inspires them. Secondly, we need to recognize that most of us talk ourselves out of what we're inspired and passionate about - most people do a ‘hatchet job’ on themselves. So, yes, it’s about developing self-belief - and I think the best way to develop self-belief is by taking baby steps in new directions. I think many people are waiting until they’ve got great self-belief before they start doing something. But you build as you go! And thirdly, you need to learn the practical skills and the ‘how to’. For example, you may be inspired to write a book, but unless you know how to structure ideas and put them in the correct format - your book might never see the shelves. It's about learning new skills as well. So, it's about inspiration… Then you need to overcome your resistance and start believing in yourself – start taking baby steps – and then learn the skills you need as you go.

INTERVIEWER: ... it seems that life coaching is the new ‘big thing’ at the moment. Lots of people seem to be taking it up… Like the sort of people I know – all very highly paid, very successful – have benefited from having a coach on hand just to help them along the way. Why is that? Are you tapping into something here? Is it something we all need or is it that society has changed so much? Maybe because we have more options? More choices open?

NICK WILLIAMS: My personal belief is that human beings are capable of so much. And yet most of us don't get a great education that inspires us and encourages us to reach our potential. So we’re channeled into ‘roles’, and into ‘jobs’ rather than into lifelong learning. So, I think one thing that coaching does is that it gives you somebody who’ll believe in you – and who can see more of what you're capable of that maybe you can. So, they encourage you... I think it was Emmerson who said something like “we all need somebody who believes in our potential, who sees what we are capable of…” I think that one of the major roles I play - as a coach - is to believe in people more than they’re sometimes able to believe in themselves.

INTERVIEWER: So, we all need that?

NICK WILLIAMS: I think everybody can benefit from it.

INTERVIEWER: Why do so many people suffer from diminished self-esteem? What's wrong with society? What’s going on?

NICK WILLIAMS: When I was writing my first book - I did a bit of research - and apparently, by the time we reach adulthood, most of us have been praised, and given recognition, and told ‘well done!’, something like 25,000 times. But apparently by the time we reach adulthood, we’ll have been put down, criticized, and ridiculed around 225,000 times. So most of us, by the time we reach adulthood, have been put down nine times more than we’ve been encouraged. So, I think many of us reach adulthood with a diminished sense of who we are and what we’re capable of - because we’ve had much more criticism than nurturing. So, I think what coaching can do is to help us reconnect with the part of us that is energized – the creative spirit that’s within every human being – and enable us to connect with that force, and ultimately, bring it to fruition.

INTERVIEWER: I love the idea that there are lots of people around the globe - listening to you right now - walking out of their jobs as we speak! Feeling so inspired, and having so much self-belief, that they take it to the extreme! That's not exactly what you're suggesting – is it?

NICK WILLIAMS: No. It's one thing to walk away from what you don't want – but it's quite another thing to create what you do want. That's obviously the second part of the equation… Handing in your resignation is the easy bit - discovering the work you really want to do - and having the ability to bring that to fruition takes time, intelligence and also courage.

INTERVIEWER: I think it's absolutely wonderful. I’m a huge, huge believer in the power of positive thinking and self-belief!

NICK WILLIAMS: Yeah – and most of us have absolutely no idea what we're capable of. If somebody had said to me 20 years ago – you’re going to write 5 books and give talks all around the world. I’d have thought - are you crazy? But - I'm doing it!

INTERVIEWER: It’s only ordinary people that do it, right?

NICK WILLIAMS: Yeah! I think that the amazing thing is that we are all amazing, but we’re not told how amazing we are, and what’s special and different about us. Everybody has the same thing - whatever you call it – it’s a creative sprit.

INTERVIEWER: Even Jackie. Jade’s mom?

NICK WILLIAMS: Yes. Sometimes it's well hidden. But yes!

INTERVIEWER: I think you’d probably need to dig long and hard!

NICK WILLIAMS: A real excavation job!

INTERVIEWER: Yes, exactly. For somebody much braver than you or I – I’m sure. Would you tackle Jackie, could you give her some help?

NICK WILLIAMS: I don’t know! I have an expression – ‘I only work with the willing!’

INTERVIEWER: That's the problem, isn't it! She doesn't seem willing to learn…

NICK WILLIAMS: And that's one of the things that I learned early on - is it's not my job to make people change. I only want to work with the people who really what to change - and I can help them to make the changes they’re inspired about making.

INTERVIEWER: Brilliant. Nick, thank you so much. It’s been truly inspiring speaking to you on a Monday morning! Thanks very much Nick.

NICK WILLIAMS: Pleasure.